atv not allowed in everglades, though rangers and rhinos are allowed

[brett711]

Response (HGM-JW) 03/25/2008 12:19 PM
The rule only pertains to all-terrain vehicles. Use this definition when determining if the vehicle is an all-terrain vehicle or not:

All-terrain vehicle – An engine-powered vehicle with wheels or tracks of less than a 60-inch wheelbase measured from the center of the forward wheel or hub to the center of the rearmost wheel or hub.

It is the definition out of the Florida Administrative Code and the one that will be used to determine if a citation needs to be issued by a law enforcement officer. Please keep in mind that the new rules were written to curb environmental damage and to reduce safety issues. Therefore, if you are riding irresponsibly, you could still be cited for damaging public lands or for reckless driving, whether or not the vehicle you are driving is technically classified as an all-terrain vehicle or not.

[jrpro130]

So if I lift my bike and extend it past 60" I can ride? Haha, sounds like a plan!!!! I was going to do it anyway

[big-daddy]

Front to rear hubs 

[~Demon_Boy250X~]

Front to rear? Longer swing arms, wider a arms, axle lol we can all make it! 

[brett711]

its redicolous...time to get a utv...cost to modify atv?

[~Demon_Boy250X~]

I am not going to do it lol i am wide enough as it is... 51" in the rear lol this just means i have to ride at seminole, and l-cross and places like that....

[Joedirt]

its redicolous...time to get a utv...cost to modify atv?

HUH?

[jrpro130]

So...I'm not understanding this.  We can ride a UTV  but not an ATV?

Whats the difference in how it effects the environment?  I still don't understand?

If thats the case I'd rather get a rhino 700 and 7" lift on 31's!!!!

[brett711]

thats right it doesnt make sense, im awaiting for fwc reply...utv allowed no atv...doesnt make sense..but thats the same rule at corbett.

[Slick89]

How is it consider "environmental damage" when we are on GOD's land doing what was intended for it..... Enjoy it. Specially muddin.... its God's dirt with God's water and when they mix it turns into mud. How is that environmental damage??? I don't understand what the problem is when is just harmless fun. Just my 2 cents

Daniel

[lswjth2]

Ok, here's how to fight this. Call or e-mail FWC and ask for the "environmental impact report" for the ATV"S, the full tracks, the buggies and the side x side", in Holylands, always invoke Florida statute 119 (FS119), if they tell you that they don't have one, then ask them how can they ban just the atv and not the rest of the group and how can then they allow the other vehicles if a report has not been made,if a report has not been done, then at this point in time you might want to let them know that you will be contacting the Sierra Club and the Florida Biodiversity group so that they can handle this with the state. Also let them know that discrimination was already tried once in America and it did not and does not work and that creating a ruling to keep away only a certain group is exactly that, discrimination.

We need to start filing small claims law suits against all these agencies, SFWMD, FWC, the county that you live in, etc. It's $50.00 and a couple hours of your time. Here's what I'm currently working in Collier county. I have a meeting on Friday with Parks and Rec staff and  I am planning on using this as a discriminatory policy towards the ORV/ATV community within the county. Here's the e-mail that I originally sent asking for a meeting, you might want to use this as a template, or not.


Subject: I need to spend sometime with someone from you staff next week if possible...Thxs

Hi Barry, hope all is well. I would like to try and set up an appointment with some one from you staff and gather information regarding parks, recreation, costs, boat ramps, public golfing facilities,bike paths, walking trails, horse trails, etc from your staff. Here's the kind of things that I'm looking to find out.

1) How many boat ramps are in Collier county, how much did it cost to build these, how many more are being planned if any at all, maintenance cost, mitigated environmental cost?

2) How many miles of bike lanes does the county have, how much did it cost to build, maintenance cost, where there environmental studies needed to put these in?

3) How many parks are in collier county, cost to build these parks, cost of maintaining this parks, including fertilizer, electric water,etc?

4) How many public golf courses are there in Collier county, yearly cost to maintain them, fertilizer use, water use, electric, environmental  studies done for the runoff  of these, cost of replanting, seeding, any profits made from these public facilities, etc?

5) Any Florida forever lands within Collier county, if so, how much and where and what are the permitted uses of these lands as of today?

6) How much "Collier conservation land" in the county and the permissible activities on this lands?

7) Does any person that currently recreates within Collier county parks or public land has to have a tracking device on their person, clothing, bicycle, walking stick, etc? If so whom?

Is there any kind of governmental mandate stating anywhere that any of these facilities HAD TO BE BUILT PER THE MANDATE, or where they built in the interest of providing recreation and access to public waterways and lands for the good of the citizens and visitors in Collier county?


Here are some of the FWC e-mail contacts that i have:


chuck.collins@fwc.state.fl.us,jeffmcgrady@myfwc.com,greg.holder@myfwc.com,ken.haddad@fwc.state.fl.us,jerrie.lindsey@myfwc.com,nick.wiley@myfwc.com,

We all need to get involved more, we are a large group, but a silent group, and if you don't cry, you wont be heard...Good luck

[Anoriginal]

You guys know I am behind you 100% and hate the loss of any place to ride. However, be careful with the term "discrimination" when considering a law suit. This really isn't a discrimination issue (speaking only about the Everglades and Holylands limitations)from a legal standpoint.

Discrimination suits can only be based on the person and the means. In otherwords, they are not preventing any of us from accessing the lands. Everyone in the USA can still access the lands. What they're doing is regulating the way in which we can access the lands which, unfortunately, is perfectly legal.

Filing suit based upon discriminatory allegations will only get you dismissed and, more than likely, sanctioned by the court via fees and costs. I hate it, but I don't want to see anyone get burned on this.

[lswjth2]

The means is the ATV (A 60 inch wheel based vehicle), where's the proof that only a 60 inch vehicle causes harm and not a 7000lb tracked vehicle?Playing Devils advocate, I know that you can school me, so please do.....I need all the info i can get ....Thxs

[jrpro130]

In response to many of the posts:

What I don't understand is the environmental damage of an ATV vs RUV.

I do fully understand the difference to the environment from ATV-Track.

Tracks have a very WIDE AND LONG footprint, they do not tend (usually) to DIG up the soil, causing damage and more "mud", and they emit a lower PSI to the soil.  Thats per FWC.

ATV's have a high PSI to the soil and they tend to dig up the soil.

I fully understand the track vs. atv difference.  But I still don't get the difference from an RUV to ATV.  My ATV  is almost 55" wide and 52" hub to hub (if I lift it, it will be 60 hub to hub).  I would think the HEAVIER RUV would tear up MUCH more soil.  Which is what theyare complaining about.

I'm behind whoever wants to take whatever action.  I'm in the "almost" catagory for fitting in.  I'm only 8" off an RUV?

[logandzwon]

So is my Outlander MAX ok?  I think it has a 60 inch wheel base.

[jrpro130]

So is my Outlander MAX ok?  I think it has a 60 inch wheel base.

Thats what I'm asking.  Your hub to hub 61" IIRC